Tal R

interview & transration / Tomio Koyama Gallery
Artist Photo / Hako Hosokawa

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Tal R and installation view at Tomio Koyama Gallery, 2007

When the painting collapse, it opens.

Please let me ask you about paintings first. All the paintings seem to have the same composition, basically with same size. So what is the difference of the pieces in your mind?

First of all, this is actually a painting of…(starting to draw) you know the woman can have her hair like this, or she can have her hair…(up) like this. In this, woman have her hair like … see, this is… Here is the eye, little bit angry. And this woman, looking. She is looking at the penis. She's looking little bit like this(angry face). The penis… is sad. But you know, the penis is not high in tree. If you are up here, you fall down, you hit yourself. The penis is very low. So it decided, that it wants to be there. It likes to be there. You know the English word, pathetic?

installation view at Tomio Koyama Gallery, 2007
right to left : "The Looook"、"The Loooook"、"The Looooook" / oil on canvas / © Tal R, 2007

Yeah.

Little bit pathetic. You know, some men, they always think of themselves like…(coughing, sad face) Woman is very strict, looking like this (looking harsh). So, that's the basic idea. When I do seven of them, I try each time, you know, I want to go to this painting.
But then I try to go to make trouble. I make trouble for my self. So I have to go…(gesture of winding road) That's why. Every time a new game. Like you know, you can say "I love you", you can say in so many ways. So seven different games. And in the end you wait for the point when the painting breaks. You know the painting goes…(gesture for split) Yeah. When the painting cannot take more and it kind of collapse. That's the beautiful painting. When the painting collapse, it opens. When the painting is ok, it's not that interesting. Painting has to break. It's beautiful. (Looking at the paper that Tal drew all over) Now you have no place to write.

About the pieces shown at Louisiana, you used only 7 colors. You'd like to have some limit or… rule always.

Always when I work, I make my own game. When you work with games, the interesting part of the game is at the border of the game. If this is the game, the game can be for instance seven colors, so when I work(drawing a circle), I don't work here(middle of circle). I am here(the edge of circle). Here(outside of circle), oh! You are not in the game. So I am here. On the edge of this game. It will look like this, but actually I am here. If I say seven colors, then here, is maybe a room. Which is not seven colors. But I just like… it's just like here. Here. Here. (pointing different edge of circle)

So game, not the rule?

Yeah, it's not a rule. It's just to say this is what I talk about and then I go to the edge of what I talk about. So here it looks like you know, you take rare limitation, take the same picture, but it's almost like the picture is like falling apart. It's almost like you know it's like in the summer, you have an ice cream and ice cream kind of melt on your hand. That's a great painting.Painting should be like the ice cream melting.

So making work is always a game, for you?

It's always a game. And it's always something that I demands for me that I really think a lot. And work a lot. Because I always know where I wanna go, I never know how to get there. And If it takes that I cut off my arm to get there, I cut off my arm. If it takes that I destroy, I destroy just to get there. Nothing is a hold for me. No style, no nothing.
So that's kind of the game that I play. And I am more interested, you can say, in me without me. It's like when my idea goes like this and I am also surprised. And I also have feeling like… whoa. Maybe when I can't understand it I know it's ok. If I only understand it, if I am 100% in control, I fall asleep.

Tal R's Studio © Tal R

So your work is always beyond our imagination.

Beyond my own imagination. I always push it to the point where my sense of aesthetic expands. If I understand this, this is what I understand. it's me, my eyes. I understand this, then I always try to see, can I understand it? Can I embrace it? Ok I can.
Sometimes, there is something here.
And I say, no I can't. But then three years later, I say, yes I understand. Cause there is not enough that you understand. You also have to embrace it.

the date of "The Loooooook" ©Tal R

How come the date on the painting is not accurate(the interview was on 24th of November but some of the paintings are dated 25th.)?

When the painting is done, I thought, it misses something, it misses the idea of time. But it doesn't have to be the right date. It doesn't have to be I finished the painting. So I thought for me, I have this freedom. My small part of the freedom is to say, oh this painting is done tomorrow. But in January, nobody knows any more. So I always put it just a little bit wrong. Cause I need the date, I need this idea of time. Time that cuts this and this month. But I don't need to see the right one.
When I work, I don't think like what should I do. I always ask what can I do. What's possible to do. I can never make a painting where I say this is the right thing to do. It always has to be what can I do. What's possible for me to do. And I always go for the point where it becomes less and less possibilities. It's almost like I cannot do anything wrong. I go for this point where painting breaks. It opens up again.

Maybe this question is meaningless. But some motif of your previous works looked more abstract, only dots and lines, and some works are more narrative. How do you decide the balance.

In the end, there are no difference between abstract or narrative. There are no different. Everything comes from reality but it's sometimes spoken in a more abstract way. But a reality behind the artwork is always in a way from reality.